Kobe is no Jordan... not even close

Kobe is no Jordan... not even close

Topic Author: Mark Van Paasschen

Posted: 5:50 PM Jun 13, 2008

Replies Posted: 16 comments

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Kobe is no Jordan... not even close

Finally the debate can be silenced, if only for a short time. But, for now, the question of Kobe or Jordan has been answered. Jordan... obviously.

Amidst all of the history surrounding a renewal of the Lakers-Celtics rivalry, there was another sports discussion taking place in NBA circles. Kobe Bryant is the proud owner of 3 NBA Championships, all of which he won with Shaq patroling the paint. In 2004, Kobe and the Lakers made it back to the Finals, but without Shaq, the question surfaced: Can Kobe win one on his own?

Michael Jordan never, NEVER, had a player of Shaq's caliber by his side for any of those 6 titles that he won with the Bulls. Scottie Pippen was a great compliment, but was no Shaq. So Jordan was able to win more with less talent than those Lakers teams of 2000-2002 had. If Shaq hadn't been on those teams, would Kobe have been able to bring home those titles alone?

Definitely not.

I think it's obvious that this series has proved that Kobe is not quite on Jordan's level. Jordan was able to drag his entire team to victory if he had too. Kobe has never done that. Michael would never have allowed his team to blow a 24 point lead in a must win game in the NBA Finals, but Kobe did. Michael never complained about being guarded by 3 or 4 defenders when he had a bad shooting night, but Kobe did that in last night's press confrence.

Don't get me wrong, I think Kobe is, by far, the best player in the league right now. But as far as the Kobe vs. MJ discussion goes... I think we can put that one to bed. All you Kobe fans, call me after he wins 2 rings without Shaq, and then we'll have something to talk about.

Mark Van Paasschen

KXII Sports

Posted by: Tim Location: New York
Umm...just a slight correction. The 2004 Lakers team did include Shaq. That was the year when Kobe was expected to earn his stripes by leading some of the best players that the NBA has ever seen. The roster included: Shaq, Karl Malone, Kobe, Derek Fisher, Gary Payton, (and of course of notable bench players), Deavean George, Rick Fox, and some other scrubs. That was the best Laker team I had seen. Yet they lost it in 6 games. So, Kobe has had every opportunity to win a ring without Shaq and just isn't capable. He's not a good enough leader.

Posted by: a Location: a
Kobe is Kobe.........Jordan is Jordan. both are great players. best of their times!

Posted by: jjcc who cares

Posted by: Ralph Location: Denison
You ask, "Can Kobe win one on his own?" Such a typical question considering this star struck attitude which pervades sports today. Basketball is a team sport. NO ONE can win a ring on their own. Sure, one player may contribute more to a teams success, but it requires five per team to play the game. Pippen may not have been Shaq, but without Pippen, MJ would still be waiting for his first ring. Likewise, without MJ, Pippen would still be waiting. In either case, both the Lakers and the Bulls won not just because of their one or two stars, there were others, both starters and bench players without whom, neither Kobe, Shaq, MJ, or Pippen would have won a ring. Check out the box scores. Review the tapes. See what the non-stars did...a key steal, a timely shot, a great pass etc. MJ may have been the best to play the game, but so what? Teams win championships.

Posted by: Will Location: Indianapolis
Hey Mark Van Paasschen, MJ didn't need a player of Shaq's caliber to beat the weak centers the Bulls faced in the finals. 2nd, Kobe won some of the finals games while Shaq was in foul trouble or hurt, for example it was Kobe who brought them back from about 20 pts when Shaq was out!So Kobe has put a team on his shoulders to get the win, and more than once! What! "If Shaq hadn't been on those teams"..!!??? Ok, what if Pippen wasn't on the bulls, what if Bird didn't have Machale, what if Magic didn't have Worthy or Jabbar??!!! Stop it. Don't single Kobe out, why is he the only who has to do it alone!!! it takes at least 2 stars, period! So MJ could drag his entire team to victory, huh? Why didn't he do that for the first 6 years of career??! It took 7, then they beat an aging, Jabbarless Laker team! Kobe got there in 4 years! If MJ was good enough to get the Bulls there in 4 yrs, they would have been crushed by the real showtime Lakers. Holla back when you get a clue! Mark ; )

Posted by: Will Location: Indianapolis
Hey Kobe Hater's! This is only the Lakers 4th year of building a championship team around Kobe and Kobe led them to the finals!In Jordan's 4th year he was busy getting booted out of the playoffs by Detroit! Detroits tough defense kept MJ from reaching the finals for 3 straight years! The Bulls won it all in the 7th year. Can Kobe get those extra 3 years before you start bashing him!?? There are too many variables to really compare Kobe and MJ, its apples and oranges. The Lakers are young and will be back, let Kobe finish his career without this constant hatred. Kobe is one of the best B-ball players you will ever see and all some of you can say is "He's no Jordan"! The Lakers over-acheived this year and lost to 3 hungry stars desparate for a ring, with one of the best defense's in years, anchored by the dpoty in KG, designed to stop the Lakers best weapon. MJ made the finals with a veteran, battle tested team, but did'nt face a defense like Boston's. You Jordan Jockin' clowns!

Posted by: david Location: whitesboro tx
i have not been around long enough to see and remember how great different teams were. But you can't compare teams from different eras. Games change so much over time it is almost impossible to tell. with the advancements in sports training and injury rehabilitation, some old players could be much better then they could have ever imagined. take for instance the the colts with a high powered passing attack. if they where to play the running style teams of the 70's, you wouldn't be able to say who is the better team due to the different styles that each era put on the table. but i do think that Jordan was the most amazing player i have ever seen play. but comparing the two players and teams could be like comparing apples and oranges.

Posted by: Taikonaut A lot was said about why Jordan was better than Kobe and lot was said about why Kobe is as good as Jordan. I'd like to take folks here back in time. I don't think people would debate my claim here that the current Celtics are not as good as the Celtics of '86, led by Bird, McHale and Parrish, or that the current Celtics is not as great a defensive team as the '86 team. Yet, in his second NBA year and way before his prime, Jordan scored 63 points (an NBA record at the time) in a playoff game against the fabled Celtics with no supporting cast. In comparison, look what happened to Kobe in this championship series. Kobe is no Jordan.

Posted by: Beth Location: Toronto
- In the Bulls' first championship run, MJ played with a bunch of scrubs and developing young players. Cartwright was past his prime and exhibited major ####age in those championship years. Pippen was a developing player but was far from being a star. Grant was also young and unpolished. Paxson was okay but not great. - In the Bulls' second championship run, the team played smarter but was much older. Jordan and Harper were in their 30s. Rodman was still a great rebounder but arguably passt his prime. Only Pippen was close to his prime. That team was also filled with scrubs. Luc freakin Longley was their centre in that triangle. Kerr was a great shooter but unathletic and terrible on D. Ditto Judd Buechler. Jason Williams, Randy Brown, Scott Burrell, Jason Caffey, Bill Wennington, Jayson Williams, Dickey Simpkins, etc: SCRUBS. Only Kukoc was the notable talent off the bench. Where do people get the idea that those Bulls teams were filled with stars?

Posted by: Beatdown Location: SA
I agree with Jeremy. We might as well argue if The Rock is better than Stone Cold Steve Austin... because the NBA is no different than pro wrestling. The league's credibility is shot and will not return until David Stern and his smug non-chalant attitude are kicked out.

Posted by: michael king Location: tampa
Lets not forget that MJ didn't have the team that Kobe had to lose a 24 point lead. MJ's supporting cast was so much better than Kobe's ever could be. Without Kobe Bryant this team doesn't make the playoffs especially this year in the West, let alone win a first round game. Without MJ, Scottie takes the same team to the second round and was 1 quarter away from advancing to the Eastern Conference Finals verse the Pacers against theie rival the New York Knicks who were favored to make it to the finals that year anyways. Its not a matter of comparing the two it is a matter of comparing their teams. Period. With the Bulls, Jordan could afford to have some bad games but with this Lakers team Kobe can not even have a bad quarter. It was also proving by Detroit that even the bests in the game needs a great team to win championships.

Posted by: Mark Location: NY
Kobe is by far NO Jordan. Playoff time was Jordan time baby. Oh and by the way, who would disagree with me that Jordan most likely would have won 8 straight if he didn't leave for 2 seasons?? The league brags about Kobe, James etc.. but its only because they MISS Jordan and all he did for the league. Hell, I barely watch the NBA anymore since Jordan's been gone. Its just not the same quality of play and competitiveness. Bring back Jordan, Magic, Bird, Thomas. I don't care if there 50, at least I'll get a great show.

Posted by: tommy Location: westhavenct
you can't compare kobe nor the entire nba to m.j.he is by far the greatest player to ever play the game of b.ball,so stop the b.s. o.k. get real people,did you see game six of the 1996 n.b.a finals come on"phenominal"""""

Posted by: Gino Exactly, alot of people don't understand that. Two years ago when Miami went to the finals with a overall better team in Mavs. Wade had the entire 5 guard him at one point and he was able to score. He did things he didn't normally did- hit threes- get to the foul line. And trust me... Mavs was not concern with Shaq he was not a factor at all. Averaged 10 points in the entire series... my point is great star players don't let their team loose like that. I mean Lakers was the best team in the West! Kobe scored 17 points...aint nothing great about that.

Posted by: Vijay Location: Irvine, ca
Being a huge Kobe fan, I do have to agree with you. He is not anywhere close. MJ was MJ and to see Kobe try to do it by himself in the second half was really disappointing. I think the worst part of it all was him not acknowledging that he probably should've shot less at the press conference. Once he started missing jumpers, the teams lost its rhythm and its agressiveness and there goes the ballgame. I feel sorry for him cos he did it for 4 years from 1996-1999 where he kept shooting without passing but him having to relearn this lesson in an MVP year is tragic for him. For some reason, Phil is much lighter on him in his second stint, trying to get Kobe to see the light himself. But what was most telling was Garnett's comments after the game where he said second half is all Kobe ball and not team ball which got them the 24 point lead in the first place. Even when they came back from a 24 point deficit in Game 2, it was cos the played team ball.

Posted by: jeremy Location: tulsa
call me when jordan wins a ring without scottie pippen, another top 50 player of all time. scottie was the best defensive player in the league and a great offensive threat. look, maybe 5% of crazies suggest kobe is as good as jordan. what's confusing is the people that say jordan is better than wilt chamberlain. it doesn't matter anyway. the nba is rigged. how about josh hamilton? is he great or what? and milton bradley gets no respect. nobody around the league is talking about the guy that is leading the AL in batting average, on base percentage and slugging percentage. instead, people talk about how bad the yankees are, chipper hitting .400 and the farce that is the nba.